Fake Patches and Trimmed High End Cards

SimonJa said:
Lol. Ya dont buy a single YG because .0000000001 percent of the population could have been trimmed. C’mon man.
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Right now there’s a catalogue being made that contains numbers submitted by these guys that have been trimming cards. You are BY ALL MEANS welcome to buy whatever you want as you please as you are also BY ALL MEANS welcome to stay away. The numbers are there for you to cross reference and making an informed purchase.

FYI, I’m a huge backer of BGS and PSA and will continue to use them but for my own sanity, I have never paid a large premium on a graded card. I’m not doing this to deter but rather to assist.
 
cardboardnostalgia said:
I can’t imagine being seriously invested in the vintage graded market right now.
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A lot of collectors probably still are, sadly.

Those who don't browse online forums probably have no idea at what has surfaced the past little while. I wouldn't say it's a "no fly zone" in collecting right now, but more of a proceed with extreme caution when looking at the vintage card market right now. Sad to see.
 
A new article from Darren Rovell outlines PWCCs damage control of repurchasing trimmed cards and turning them over to the Feds as well as PSAs reluctance to take any blame in this but noting that Joe Orlando has sold of more than 30% of his own stock in the company.

Also mentioned is an example of market fixing by one group of people, which I still believe happened to the Crosby Young Guns when it seemingly doubled overnight.

https://www.actionnetwork.com/gener...ia-fraud-national-sports-collector-convention
 
Triple B said:
A new article from Darren Rovell outlines PWCCs damage control of repurchasing trimmed cards and turning them over to the Feds as well as PSAs reluctance to take any blame in this but noting that Joe Orlando has sold of more than 30% of his own stock in the company.

Also mentioned is an example of market fixing by one group of people, which I still believe happened to the Crosby Young Guns when it seemingly doubled overnight.

https://www.actionnetwork.com/gener...ia-fraud-national-sports-collector-convention
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Great article. I've never been into graded cards and all the crap coming out now proves that I was right in staying away. I'm not saying everyone should stop using BGS or PSA but it's now become "at your own risk". I'm glad I have no graded cards in a personal collection...
 
Triple B said:
A new article from Darren Rovell outlines PWCCs damage control of repurchasing trimmed cards and turning them over to the Feds as well as PSAs reluctance to take any blame in this but noting that Joe Orlando has sold of more than 30% of his own stock in the company.

Also mentioned is an example of market fixing by one group of people, which I still believe happened to the Crosby Young Guns when it seemingly doubled overnight.

https://www.actionnetwork.com/gener...ia-fraud-national-sports-collector-convention
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Read this last night. Eye opining for sure.
 
I have never cared for this, I am old school and my cards I want to be able to enjoy whether in an album in sheets or loose in a stack. I have cracked every card out of it's slabbed housing and set free, to be able to breath and feel more like a collectible piece.
 
BergyShines03 said:
I have never cared for this, I am old school and my cards I want to be able to enjoy whether in an album in sheets or loose in a stack. I have cracked every card out of it's slabbed housing and set free, to be able to breath and feel more like a collectible piece.
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I go this route too with nearly all my cards as well.
 
BergyShines03 said:
I have never cared for this, I am old school and my cards I want to be able to enjoy whether in an album in sheets or loose in a stack. I have cracked every card out of it's slabbed housing and set free, to be able to breath and feel more like a collectible piece.
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I completely agree
 
BergyShines03 said:
I have never cared for this, I am old school and my cards I want to be able to enjoy whether in an album in sheets or loose in a stack. I have cracked every card out of it's slabbed housing and set free, to be able to breath and feel more like a collectible piece.
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The problem now is that if a trimmed card is cracked out of it's case, you wouldn't know if it's one of those cards that have been altered.

I don't know exactly how much they are trimming off. Maybe you can tell. But 1/64" for a vintage card wouldn't raise any eyebrows. Or if the card was originally ever so slightly wider, and then got trimmed to "normal" size.

The issue isn't whether the card is slabbed or not, it's that it has been altered to make it seem in better condition. With these cards floating out there, there is a risk of buying an altered card. Someone could come with you with a raw Bobby Orr card that looks super fantastic. Problem is that it happens to be one of the trimmed cards and someone cracked it out the of the case, and now says it was found in his grandfather's attic last week.
 
As everyone knows.. I PC Dave Schultz.. I bought my PSA Mint 9 Dave Schultz OPC Rookie not a super high end card .. from none other than our own Gomaz... I’m not breaking it free Nor do I suspect any tampering!!! Thank you again Jeremy!!!
 
Between this and “game used” jersey cards, how can you trust anything in the hobby anymore? I have a Lemieux OPC rookie graded BGS 8.5 which you’d think has to be legit since it isn’t a high grade but I have some recent Flames YG rookies BGS 9.5. All this makes me question whether or not I should even continue collecting those.
 
It's so absurd the price people will pay for graded stuff. I understand some of the vintage...but good lord the modern stuff? People will pay huge prices for a PSA 10 young gun that was packed out a year or less ago? Most of these cards are all gem mint whether it's graded or not. It's like throwing money away in my opinion. Now you don't even know if that graded YG is legit.
 
A couple years ago I was buying Matthews Young Guns for $120US max, paying about $20US to grade them and immediately resold them again for $200+ if they were BGS 9.5 or better, which about 90% of my submissions were.

Easiest way to make money in this hobby and I don't see the value of these modern cards that are graded high holding their value like the vintage market.
 
USA Today has picked up the story. This is going more and more mainstream.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...-trading-card-scam-been-uncovered/1929959001/

As well, Sports Collectors Daily has a piece on Jeff Lichtmann, PWCC's lawyer and a litte on why he took the case. Speaking to a few dealers at the National, Lichtmann has been HIGHLY critical of PWCC and they think he got involved because he has a ton invested in vintage and is trying to help clean things up to protect his investment (I don't blame him ONE BIT) and he says some of that in this article.

https://www.sportscollectorsdaily.c...iminal-defense-attorney-cooperating-with-fbi/
 

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