Interesting note from the Topps Q&A at The National

[Triple B]

Distributors have become a HUGE part of the problem. My LCS says that he was allocated on 15/16 and 16/17 stuff and knows factually that distributors are sitting on a mountain of the stuff knowing full well that 17/18 is going to be a poor year. He says that pre-orders or even TALK of 17/18 stuff is almost non-existent as compared to the last two years.

I love that companies are now bypassing distributors and going direct to consumer. It's sarcastically heartbreaking to hear distributors cry over it. For YEARS they've held a gun to dealers' heads (who then have to pass that down to the collectors) when it comes to what and how much can be ordered. They've outlasted their original intent and use.

 

[oiler8]

My two cents:

I like some parts of Upper Deck A LOT.
I like some parts of Upper Deck a little.
I hate some parts of Upper Deck A LOT.

I only buy hockey so I'm not up to date with what Topps is doing, but I have heard a lot of positive.

I HATE EXCLUSIVES!!!!!!!

For that reason alone, PLEASE bring in Topps and/or Panini for something new and some competition. Please.

I don't want Upper Deck gone, I just want to see at least one more horse in the race. With 1 horse, you walk and not try and you'll finish first every time. 2+ horses and effort is needed.

This would be awesome for the hobby.

 

[jogesc2]

Distributors have become a HUGE part of the problem. My LCS says that he was allocated on 15/16 and 16/17 stuff and knows factually that distributors are sitting on a mountain of the stuff knowing full well that 17/18 is going to be a poor year.

So is their belief that 17/18 will be so bad that people will go back and buy 15/16 and 16/17 products?

 

[THSN]

Distribution SHOULD be a holding warehouse for retail stores. Their margins should hold steady no matter the hype around any product. If a product is hot then it should be the retailers that reap the benefits NOT the distributor.

THIS. A distributor is supposed to be functioning as a middleman between the manufacturer and the retailer, not as a middle retailer. Margins should be set and checked by the retailer and if the distributor can't make it on those margins, either his business model needs to change or a new agreement needs to be discussed.

 

[Triple B]

So is their belief that 17/18 will be so bad that people will go back and buy 15/16 and 16/17 products?

That's the idea. You ask people here and a lot will say that they will spend their money on the last two years' products rather than 17/18. That being said, it's not to say that 17/18 is going to be ignored. I've stated elsewhere that I believe UD will be riding the bounty program HARD this year so everyone will still be busting new products no matter what. Their losses will just be a little bigger than usual.

 

[cremona71]

Distribution SHOULD be a holding warehouse for retail stores. Their margins should hold steady no matter the hype around any product. If a product is hot then it should be the retailers that reap the benefits NOT the distributor.
This is what keeps retailers in business. Distributors in Canada basically become retailers after product launch, but their job is to be the middle man FOR retailers. If a retailer can't buy a product from their distributor and make a profit based on market value then what's the point of them? When the distributor is selling 16/17 UD1 for $200 per box when the MARKET RETAIL price on them is $125US (155 CAD) then how could ANY retailer in Canada afford to buy it? The answer of course is that they ONLY care about maximizing their profits and selling to group breakers who can hide the price increases over 30 or more buyers. The whole industry is just garbage now.

Distribution should under no circumstances be a warehouse. They are a business to and do need to continue to increase revenue to grow. The business is WAY beyond hockey cards which a lot of people have a ton of problems understanding. Distribution need to increase the cost on hotter products after preorders are done because they also take a bath on a bunch of products. You know all the 2012/13 and 2013/14 products? Tell your shop to buy some of that stuff as it will come super cheap. Its on skids in a warehouse the the distributor has taken a bath on.

 

[cremona71]

Distributors have become a HUGE part of the problem. My LCS says that he was allocated on 15/16 and 16/17 stuff and knows factually that distributors are sitting on a mountain of the stuff knowing full well that 17/18 is going to be a poor year. He says that pre-orders or even TALK of 17/18 stuff is almost non-existent as compared to the last two years.

I love that companies are now bypassing distributors and going direct to consumer. It's sarcastically heartbreaking to hear distributors cry over it. For YEARS they've held a gun to dealers' heads (who then have to pass that down to the collectors) when it comes to what and how much can be ordered. They've outlasted their original intent and use.

Ryan I promise you that as far as I am aware of distribution is not hoarding anything. It doesn't make any sense to. I can promise you any smart shop has hoarded some product though.

 

[THSN]

Distributors grow their businesses by adding profitable lines and dropping dead weight, not by hoarding product and jacking up the price. That last bit? That's retailing.

We would buy more of the 12/13 and 13/14 products except 1) expired redemptions in the UD stuff they won't honor and 2) the prices being asked are generally more than the consumer can find from the big guys in the States. So, no, not really super cheap.

And if they aren't hoarding anything, why do they run out of hot products the day of release, but then have them available again two days later at a markup?

 

[webottew]

Someone is obviously sitting on a LOT of product somewhere in the distribution chain.

When Manufacturers claim "Sold Out", does that mean the entire print run is released on Release day? Or do they continue to release the product after Release.

Supposedly, the distributors are the only buyers that work directly with the Manufacturer. If all product is created before and released on Release Day, then this is the first spot there can be a hoarding situation.

Sure, an LCS may have ordered a ton of product, but claim they were shorted their allotment. Perhaps it is a large conspiracy pact since several LCS report the same thing, even the bigger stores. So of the LCSes that frequent this board, which ones are telling the truth when they say their Release Day allotments were rationed? Are all LCSes in on the alleged hoarding situation?

To blame a small LCS for not ordering more product and then complaining about a hot product rising in price is silly. If this is acceptable, then a similar argument would be the collector can't complain about rising box prices because they should have anticipated the demand and pre-bought all their boxes for the first day.

Either the distributor or the manufacturer is holding back product. A good clue are retail blasters. This past Christmas (Dec 2016), several shelves worth of 15-16 Series 1 appeared out of nowhere at my local Walmart. That's a year after release of a very hot product. Where did that come from? Walmart is too streamlined to have pallets of product just sitting around. And Walmart certainly doesn't buy their cards from a local LCS hoarder. Does Walmart not deal with the same distributors as the LCS? Those 15-16 boxes had to come from upstream...

 

[cremona71]

Someone is obviously sitting on a LOT of product somewhere in the distribution chain.

When Manufacturers claim "Sold Out", does that mean the entire print run is released on Release day? Or do they continue to release the product after Release.

Supposedly, the distributors are the only buyers that work directly with the Manufacturer. If all product is created before and released on Release Day, then this is the first spot there can be a hoarding situation.

Sure, an LCS may have ordered a ton of product, but claim they were shorted their allotment. Perhaps it is a large conspiracy pact since several LCS report the same thing, even the bigger stores. So of the LCSes that frequent this board, which ones are telling the truth when they say their Release Day allotments were rationed? Are all LCSes in on the alleged hoarding situation?

To blame a small LCS for not ordering more product and then complaining about a hot product rising in price is silly. If this is acceptable, then a similar argument would be the collector can't complain about rising box prices because they should have anticipated the demand and pre-bought all their boxes for the first day.

Either the distributor or the manufacturer is holding back product. A good clue are retail blasters. This past Christmas (Dec 2016), several shelves worth of 15-16 Series 1 appeared out of nowhere at my local Walmart. That's a year after release of a very hot product. Where did that come from? Walmart is too streamlined to have pallets of product just sitting around. And Walmart certainly doesn't buy their cards from a local LCS hoarder. Does Walmart not deal with the same distributors as the LCS? Those 15-16 boxes had to come from upstream...

Typically when a manufacturer claims they are sold it they are not actually "sold out" Upper Deck for example has to keep a set amount in their own warehouses for American stores as they can deal directly with them. The short answer is if a manufacturer has fulfilled their pre-orders and has a little bit left over to service additional ordering then they would most likely consider that sold out. This is also dependent on the type of product it is.

Yes. A collector cannot complain when a hot product has gone up $30-$50 two weeks after release. Pre orders people. Pre orders.

You cannot site 15/16 Series 1 blasters into any conversation. You pretty much cant count ANY 15/16 low end release. They printed it into oblivion originally in addition to having additional print runs as time went on.