Patch forger... caught! gomaz would be proud ;)

FrankToronto said:
I don't know how he's playing it off. I may be naive, but I'm hoping that he clears his reputation - which he said he knows he has to do.

No one has suggested to us that he be banned from attending the show, but we chose to do so.
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How do you clear your reputation when there's proof that cards he was selling via eBay thru HIS account from when just he got busted, have recently been on another dealers site from your own show. Just pm some of the guys to find out!!! Why would you even want a guy like this to clear his reputation??? Why would you waste you time or even ruin your own credibility by even standing next to the guy and chatting "hobby" with him. I'd also know who the other dealers at your show are ( ebay id's) as I'd like to seriously consider blocking them all. I espcially don't want to waste my time and hard earned money buying or even dealing with anyone remotely involved with Kenny and other dealers at your show where this guy even blinks at!!!!!

If I were you I would of PERMANENTLY banned this guy as it honestly makes your show look BAD for even letting this guy come in. It's really sad on your part after all this fake patching thing came out you even let the guy walk in there. If I lived in Toronto and walked in on your show and saw this guy even remotely talking to a dealer... I promise you that would of been the last time I ever attended and probably wouldn't come back!!!!

Honestly I don't know who you are or ever have been to one of your shows but I will tell you chances are I wouldn't probabaly attend it. Even just to let this guy walk in your show and to let him in is a disgrace and a punch in the face to people in this hobby!!!
Maybe I'm blowing this whole (showing up at you card show scenario and LETTING HIM IN) outta proportion but I don't understand why on earth you would let him in at all? Especially that it's well documnted that a BIG dealer there has been selling fakes (whether knowingly or knowingly) for a while. Why on earth would you want this guy to even remotely be affiliated with your show, talking to dealers, sitting behind a dealers table after the TONS of cards he's swindle'd GOOD HOBBY people out of their own money.

Unfortunately I've lost ALL respect for you and your show and I am at a loss for words, even to think of mentioning you may give this guy a 6 month ban and remotely think this guy is remorseful at all!!!!

I can show you emails where this guy has laughed in alot of people buying these cards and has even mentioned to me, via emails, that he can't wait to see what fakes collectors will be buying here in the future. He mentions alot of these collectors are suckers with a ton of expletives and so on.....

Again I'm not going to go on about this guy as he's a waste and I really think for your show to stay true to the collectors you wouldn't want this guy at all affiliated or even been seen at your show or any dealers even "chit chatting" or having this guy sitting with them at their tables is absolutely ludicrous!!!!

SHAME ON YOU!!!!
 
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FrankToronto said:
I don't know how he's playing it off. I may be naive, but I'm hoping that he clears his reputation - which he said he knows he has to do.

No one has suggested to us that he be banned from attending the show, but we chose to do so.
Click to expand...

Honestly it's like having some crazed pedophile hanging out at some elementary school playground..... Wrong place to be hanging around at. Exact thing with having Kenny showing up at your show, talking to your dealers at the show and wandering the aisles...you're just asking for trouble in having the guy "hang out" there!!!!
 
Frank,

I hate to say it, but I have to agree with Deankal, though maybe not as emphatically. You don't owe Kenny anything, and he's more of a detriment to the show than any sort of positive. This isn't a young kid that got caught stealing a card of his favourite player. This is someone who abused his position of authority (albeit as a card dealer) to swindle people out of their money. Unless he's actually gone back to every single person he sold a fake to, I think you should be avoiding him like the plague.

I know you well enough to know you're honest, good natured guy, and I don't fault you for that, but in this case, I think you need to be harsh.

Just my opinion, and let it be known, I'll still attend the show. I know you didn't think it would harm anything by letting Kenny back in the show, but I'm telling you as a former dealer at your show, and as a friend, I wouldn't want to see him there again.

Cory
 
Kenny needs to walk away from the hobby entirely, but I don't think his addiction will let him. Some have chosen to forgive and offer a second chance, but I think the popular consensus is that no one wants to deal with him or to be associated with him. He's made his bed and he has to sleep in it. No one owes him anything and no one should be in the position (or feel the need) to offer him a lifeline. If he wants to make amends, he knows how to do it. The cheques should be in the mail.

I wouldn't be surprised to see him in Cleveland this week either.
 
Triple B said:
Kenny needs to walk away from the hobby entirely, but I don't think his addiction will let him. Some have chosen to forgive and offer a second chance, but I think the popular consensus is that no one wants to deal with him or to be associated with him. He's made his bed and he has to sleep in it. No one owes him anything and no one should be in the position (or feel the need) to offer him a lifeline. If he wants to make amends, he knows how to do it. The cheques should be in the mail.

I wouldn't be surprised to see him in Cleveland this week either.
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Really?!?!?! That would mind boggle me...... I am surprised nobody has confronted him. I guess it is a lot harder to tell someone your true feelings without a computer screen in front of you;)
 
For all of us that don't know "Kenny" from the next person, I think it would be a great plan to let everyone here know pertinent info about him, such as:
a) What does he look like?
b) Does he have a name for his booth at shows? (like "Kenny's rip-you-off Cards")
c) At shows, does he use display cases, sell McFarlane's, look like a degenerate bum,etc?
c) What is his ebay handle?
d) What are his other online aliases?

But even more importantly, I have to chime in here on what some of the other members are saying about him still setting-up at shows....If you are a member here on H.I. and run a show, or are connected to people that do, then it is your rightful duty to the hobby collecting community, the people paying gate fees to attend these shows to get ripped off from this piece of garbage, and finally you're duty to us all here on H.I. to state publically that business is being taking care of accordingly with this degenerate d-bag!!!

I fully agree with Dean and countless others, and this scam artist should not only be banned from shows, but should be facing criminal charges....at a bare freakin minimum!!!

On a side note, this thread is going on waaay to long. I suggest we not glamorize this scammer's inflated criminal ego, and simply take action against him as a collecting community...for the simple sanity and dignity of this hobby of ours!
 
Might start a fight will not do that as it has nothing to do with the topic at hand...what a comparison though
 
This scumbag has changed his Ebay ID twice since he was exposed for the fraud artist that he is...........his new Ebay ID......*ryuijchi*nishigiuchi* .
 
Could someone please post a description of this loser for those of us who don't know him? I'd just as soon not give him any more of my money.
 
Sorry for bumping this up, but I have dealt with Kenny in person several times and had no idea in hell he would pull this kind of thing since he was always fair with me. Now I wonder if any of the cards he traded me(Getzlaf CUP, Malkin Ultimate Patch etc etc) were fake. This totally sickens me and I am at a complete lost for words. I am almost teary eyed b/c I am in such shock!!! Again, sorry for bumping this, but felt I should say something..
 
I've been told he went to the National to unload the rest of his cards, as he's a "hot commodity" in the Toronto area. I'll be following his actions in the future with extreme interest, as well as some of his "friends".

The ONLY way we're going to get this sort of crap out of our hobby is for the collectors to band together and "out" the thieves.
 
I am starting to wonder if the Perry CUP he traded me which is the cornerstone of my PC is a fake. Just lovely...
 
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He was at the National and I'll admit I was a bit surprised to see him there. In his defense, both days I saw him he was empty handed. I'm not that naive, though.

Let me also just say that I will be gigantically surprised if he shows up at the Expo. If people follow up their tough talk with actions, for his safety, I'd recommend he stay away.
 
Wow, this was a long read. Great stuff!! I'm only on page 12 and don't have time to finish this now but one thought comes to mind, and it seems to be a logical solution (or part-solution) for UD:

STOP PRODUCING CRAPPY ONE-COLOUR "PATCHES"!!

It seems that nobody wants them, they sell far too cheap on the secondary market and that offers the forgers a huge opportunity to add a great patch swatch in it's place and make a big margin off the card. Better patch swatches means higher prices on average, which means higher risk and lower margins for the patch forgers. Especially for high-end products like Cup, Ultimate and OPC Premier.

Higher quality patches means lower print numbers, higher scarcity, and hopefully an increased demand on the secondary market. Would anyone in this hobby object to this type of move by UD?
 
Interestingly I think some one-colour patches are necessary to increase the demand of the high-end ones. If a card is numbered to 99 and all 99 of them are gorgeous patches, the demand would go down. If 20 of them are crappy and 30 of them are OK and only 49 of them are really nice, those 49 are going to command a premium, no?
 
deanengemoen said:
Interestingly I think some one-colour patches are necessary to increase the demand of the high-end ones. If a card is numbered to 99 and all 99 of them are gorgeous patches, the demand would go down. If 20 of them are crappy and 30 of them are OK and only 49 of them are really nice, those 49 are going to command a premium, no?
Click to expand...

UD also has to use ALL their pieces... remember that some logos (i.e. Leafs) have large areas of one-colour. It's fiscally responsible for them to use all their pieces.

The patch archive is a HUGE step in the right direction. How it moves forward is still up in the air, but until these patches are either forge-proof or somehow otherwise tamper-proof, the archive is the way to go.
 
NNeves said:
Wow, this was a long read. Great stuff!! I'm only on page 12 and don't have time to finish this now but one thought comes to mind, and it seems to be a logical solution (or part-solution) for UD:

STOP PRODUCING CRAPPY ONE-COLOUR "PATCHES"!!

It seems that nobody wants them, they sell far too cheap on the secondary market and that offers the forgers a huge opportunity to add a great patch swatch in it's place and make a big margin off the card. Better patch swatches means higher prices on average, which means higher risk and lower margins for the patch forgers. Especially for high-end products like Cup, Ultimate and OPC Premier.

Higher quality patches means lower print numbers, higher scarcity, and hopefully an increased demand on the secondary market. Would anyone in this hobby object to this type of move by UD?
Click to expand...

Except there have been cards faked where the original patch was already multi-colored?
 

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